This is so pastoral. So helpful. Thank you Jack Deere and family.
As someone who served at IHOPKC from 2008-Nov 2023 I never once heard a teaching on false prophets or how to discern what’s true and what is not. For a ministry that is strengthened in their mandate through the prophetic, you would think this would be a major pastoral and practical teaching found at IHOPKC. Especially in a ministry full of 18-25 year olds.
Thank you for stepping into the arena. You have no idea how much it means to me, and others in my similar position, who are now left to do the hard work of disentangling from unhelpful (yea, toxic) ministry cultures.
It is men of God like yourself that make me feel it’s possible to love God, be honest and real with our humanity, and live simple lives of pleasing obedience to Jesus. Thank you. Thank you.
This is such an important testimony. Thank you so much for sharing it! May God open the eyes of those who are still following Paul Cain and Mike Bickle and others like them. May God deliver his people from leaders like this.
I saw Paul speak at a pastor's luncheon in Holland, Michigan in the mid to late 90s. I had heard of his fame and his accuracy. I sat down and he got up to speak and I immediately knew he was homosexual and that he was currently acting on it. I told my wife and my best friend. I never told anyone else until the news of his fall from ministry broke out in the fall of 2004 while I was on staff at IHOPKC.
Are you serious? It was an impression from the Lord. I had no proof or evidence and I had NO connection to him or his ministry circle. What do you think I should have done?
So good. I really appreciate the sharing of this chapter from the book for all to read. Thank you Jack Deere and thank you Stephen Deere for publishing here. I never saw Paul Cain in person -- only heard him on cassette tapes and a few VHS tapes. RT Kendall also talks about Pauls lack of biblical knowledge. I learned about PC from the college students at my church in Oregon who went to IHOPKC conferences. I didn't know about Mike's early years, but once they started streaming online, I became a supporter. Didn't know Jack had connections with IHOPKC -- always knew him through Rick Joyner. I so valued Jack's teachings...I had two of the "Surprised Books" (...by the Spirit? and by the Voice of God). I think I had some teachings by Jack on tape when I belonged to Rick Joyner's "Tape of the Month" club. Anyway, I loved his books -- so helpful for me in my early encounters with the Holy Spirit. I must have leant them out and never got them back! I don't have them anymore. I'm glad he is still writing. He's an asset to church!
To my knowledge, Jack Deere is the only charismatic to openly show the bad character of Mike Bickle. In the 1990’s Deere, Joyner, Wimber, Bickle, and Bob Jones all knew each other. So I was close to seeing a widespread Ichabod sign over the entire association. Deere gives me some hope that the 4 to 5 national leaders will again confront Mike Bickle. He could be “delivered to satan,” for his obvious coverup tactics. Lou Engle made one statement about MB, but he knows SO much more.
This is the type of information that I wish I had been given years ago. Everyone's in my circle revered PC. Wimber was widely criticized for breaking off from Paul and many people alleged that the reason Wimber died was due to his rejection of the prophetic ministry. (Although he didn’t reject the prophetic, but the lack of accountability of the prophets).
Jack, I hope you put this chapter back in the second edition!
Especially appreciate how you identified your hunger for power was something that allowed you to be manipulated. Leaders need to be taught to address this in their own hearts, and also identify it in other leaders.
I also appreciate you addressing the use of spiritual gifts in a carnal way. A lot of people struggle to accept that a good gift can be misused with ill intent.
I have been new to the prophetic the last few years and picked up Jack’s original copy of this book in 2021. I feel like my hunger has always been for knowledge and God’s Word—and there has been a recent shift in desire to witness and understand and move in the supernatural since 2020—so foreign to my prior experience.
All of these previous prophetic voices—I’d never heard of before, they simply were not talked about in the evangelical spheres I’d walked in (Baptist, Calvary Chapel, Wheaton College, etc.). I’d not heard of Cain, Jones, Bickle, Wimber, the ‘Kansas City Prophets,’ or even the Toronto Blessing, Brownsville, their effects or criticisms—even though these people and events existed or occurred in my lifetime. I knew of the Jesus People Movement (just a decade prior to my birth), but had not been privy to understanding what happened with Lonnie, or the connections to Vineyard. We have not taught the generations behind us these things, and have not crossed theological and denominational spheres in many ways. But that to say—the introduction of the last few years has been a steep learning curve in names, movements, vocabulary, cautions and need for discernment in foreign-to-me concepts, teachers and teachings, histories and wisdom for gifts. I greatly value help and experience in how to navigate these things—Jack, Sam Storms, Francis Chan, and the guys at Remnant Radio have helped quite a bit to provide a framework that I’ve lacked while still rooted in evangelicalism.
I also really value Jack being transparent for his own desires for Biblical knowledge, power and to be special. It reminds me to check myself, examine my heart and pursue Christ for His sake and not my own glory, to minister to others out of love and not desire for admiration. Oh Lord let me remain humble, honest and transparent!
Thank you Deere family for transparency—we need more in the body of Christ.
When I first read this article, I thought, “too little too late”, but after completing this reading & your first writing regarding Mike Bickle, I’m actually encouraged. The prophetic is very real, but it must be married to God’s Word, God’s nature, and God’s character. Thank you for your honesty & transparency.
I was one of the “lucky” interns (2000-2001) who got to clean the Shiloh estates, where Paul’s KC office was. Every time he and his assistant came on property I had this deep feeling of heavy sorrow, my 18 year old self could only rationalize it as a sense of sobriety, as I recognized a life of isolation, and this sense that his assistant was trapped in hiden-ness as well) as an adult, I have come to recognize it was an empathetic gift, and a discerning of the grief in God’s heart over Paul’s choices, and abuses. My heart has broken many times over when I think of what was taken from such a bright young man as his assistant was/is….
What we need most in the Body of Christ (besides Christ’s holy love) is HIS TREASURE which is “ The fear of the Lord.” Isaiah 33:6! We also need a deep abiding love for the Word of God. Many are deceived because the don’t fear God nor reverence HIS WORD. Check out Derek Prince ‘s teaching “The Fear of the Lord HIS TREASURE” (YOUTUBE).
Also John Bevere’s outstanding book THE AWE OF GOD! People who love the fear of the Lord will not even entertain a filthy thought! They know holiness is a weapon against the forces of darkness!
We also must stop putting people in leadership on pedestals! People in leadership need our prayers and accountability! No one who does not fear God nor reverence His Word should be in leadership over Christ’s Body…plain and simple!
This is fascinating. As a yound person at Vineyard Anaheim in the late 80's I witnessed some of what Jack is speaking about. I have a vivid memory of the first time I saw Paul Cain preach on the Anaheim stage. I was completely dumbfounded by the lack of Jesus or the Gospel in the message, and it was somewhat incoherent. I thought, "he must be having a bad day"......
Was there anyone out there to whom God revealed the secret of Paul Cain supernaturally? Yes, I was one of them. I was in an Episcopal Seminary Library outside of Pittsburgh, Pa. reading a Charisma Magazine article ( 1990) on the budding prophetic movement. Paul Cain's picture was featured. As I looked at him I heard the Holy Spirit say, "he struggles with homosexuality"! I was recently baptized in the Holy Spirit so hearing God clearly like this was surprising to me. I hide this for 14 years until the 2004 reveal of Paul's sins. Even If I had known how to share this with someone in leadership over Paul I would have been shut down. The prophets were almost worshipped at this time..
To be honest, I would challenge that anything from Paul was real. People are so desperate for something real they blind themselves to the con artist/grifter.
Paul learned from the best con/grifter - William Branham. Paul got that schtick down - just like Branham did - and all the phonies before that - Dowie,
For those interested in getting an education re Branham, healing revivals, Latter Rain, I recommend the work of John Collins (grandson of pastor at Branham's church in Jeffersonville) - William Branham Historical Research - - there are MANY very informative podcasts on YT - where the stage tricks and deception are exposed.
It was good to read such an honest assessment of Paul and I truly appreciate the honestly of Jack’s response to the false prophecy Paul gave to Jack.
Being in the ministry my husband are in since 1980 and having been in the Vineyard since 1979 we’ve trying to “help” broken leaders like Lonnie Frisbee to Paul Cain to many others. Unfortunately so often there isn’t the level of true confession and repentance that leads to their full personal restoration.
But can I say my favorite sentence was “John gave.”! I’m very aware that Wimber had shortcomings and made some mistakes along the way but knowing as well and as closely as we have is one of the greatest honors in my life.
In decades to come the impact of Wimber and the Vineyard will still be bearing fruit to the body of Christ. I’m glad we all get to play!
This is so pastoral. So helpful. Thank you Jack Deere and family.
As someone who served at IHOPKC from 2008-Nov 2023 I never once heard a teaching on false prophets or how to discern what’s true and what is not. For a ministry that is strengthened in their mandate through the prophetic, you would think this would be a major pastoral and practical teaching found at IHOPKC. Especially in a ministry full of 18-25 year olds.
Thank you for stepping into the arena. You have no idea how much it means to me, and others in my similar position, who are now left to do the hard work of disentangling from unhelpful (yea, toxic) ministry cultures.
It is men of God like yourself that make me feel it’s possible to love God, be honest and real with our humanity, and live simple lives of pleasing obedience to Jesus. Thank you. Thank you.
This is such an important testimony. Thank you so much for sharing it! May God open the eyes of those who are still following Paul Cain and Mike Bickle and others like them. May God deliver his people from leaders like this.
I saw Paul speak at a pastor's luncheon in Holland, Michigan in the mid to late 90s. I had heard of his fame and his accuracy. I sat down and he got up to speak and I immediately knew he was homosexual and that he was currently acting on it. I told my wife and my best friend. I never told anyone else until the news of his fall from ministry broke out in the fall of 2004 while I was on staff at IHOPKC.
Tom I was at that same meeting! And wow, that’s crazy you got that impression.
I have fairly good “gaydar” and the Holy Spirit helped a bit!
My wife has fairly good gaydar as well. I'm starting to think I do too.
So you knew a teacher, prophet was in active homosexuality and you stayed silent? Wow take a bow ACCOMPLICE🏆
Are you serious? It was an impression from the Lord. I had no proof or evidence and I had NO connection to him or his ministry circle. What do you think I should have done?
So good. I really appreciate the sharing of this chapter from the book for all to read. Thank you Jack Deere and thank you Stephen Deere for publishing here. I never saw Paul Cain in person -- only heard him on cassette tapes and a few VHS tapes. RT Kendall also talks about Pauls lack of biblical knowledge. I learned about PC from the college students at my church in Oregon who went to IHOPKC conferences. I didn't know about Mike's early years, but once they started streaming online, I became a supporter. Didn't know Jack had connections with IHOPKC -- always knew him through Rick Joyner. I so valued Jack's teachings...I had two of the "Surprised Books" (...by the Spirit? and by the Voice of God). I think I had some teachings by Jack on tape when I belonged to Rick Joyner's "Tape of the Month" club. Anyway, I loved his books -- so helpful for me in my early encounters with the Holy Spirit. I must have leant them out and never got them back! I don't have them anymore. I'm glad he is still writing. He's an asset to church!
To my knowledge, Jack Deere is the only charismatic to openly show the bad character of Mike Bickle. In the 1990’s Deere, Joyner, Wimber, Bickle, and Bob Jones all knew each other. So I was close to seeing a widespread Ichabod sign over the entire association. Deere gives me some hope that the 4 to 5 national leaders will again confront Mike Bickle. He could be “delivered to satan,” for his obvious coverup tactics. Lou Engle made one statement about MB, but he knows SO much more.
This is the type of information that I wish I had been given years ago. Everyone's in my circle revered PC. Wimber was widely criticized for breaking off from Paul and many people alleged that the reason Wimber died was due to his rejection of the prophetic ministry. (Although he didn’t reject the prophetic, but the lack of accountability of the prophets).
Jack, I hope you put this chapter back in the second edition!
Thank you for these important reflections!
Especially appreciate how you identified your hunger for power was something that allowed you to be manipulated. Leaders need to be taught to address this in their own hearts, and also identify it in other leaders.
I also appreciate you addressing the use of spiritual gifts in a carnal way. A lot of people struggle to accept that a good gift can be misused with ill intent.
Thank you Deere family for bringing people into the truth.
Thank you Jack. Dear God help us.
I have been new to the prophetic the last few years and picked up Jack’s original copy of this book in 2021. I feel like my hunger has always been for knowledge and God’s Word—and there has been a recent shift in desire to witness and understand and move in the supernatural since 2020—so foreign to my prior experience.
All of these previous prophetic voices—I’d never heard of before, they simply were not talked about in the evangelical spheres I’d walked in (Baptist, Calvary Chapel, Wheaton College, etc.). I’d not heard of Cain, Jones, Bickle, Wimber, the ‘Kansas City Prophets,’ or even the Toronto Blessing, Brownsville, their effects or criticisms—even though these people and events existed or occurred in my lifetime. I knew of the Jesus People Movement (just a decade prior to my birth), but had not been privy to understanding what happened with Lonnie, or the connections to Vineyard. We have not taught the generations behind us these things, and have not crossed theological and denominational spheres in many ways. But that to say—the introduction of the last few years has been a steep learning curve in names, movements, vocabulary, cautions and need for discernment in foreign-to-me concepts, teachers and teachings, histories and wisdom for gifts. I greatly value help and experience in how to navigate these things—Jack, Sam Storms, Francis Chan, and the guys at Remnant Radio have helped quite a bit to provide a framework that I’ve lacked while still rooted in evangelicalism.
I also really value Jack being transparent for his own desires for Biblical knowledge, power and to be special. It reminds me to check myself, examine my heart and pursue Christ for His sake and not my own glory, to minister to others out of love and not desire for admiration. Oh Lord let me remain humble, honest and transparent!
Thank you Deere family for transparency—we need more in the body of Christ.
When I first read this article, I thought, “too little too late”, but after completing this reading & your first writing regarding Mike Bickle, I’m actually encouraged. The prophetic is very real, but it must be married to God’s Word, God’s nature, and God’s character. Thank you for your honesty & transparency.
I was one of the “lucky” interns (2000-2001) who got to clean the Shiloh estates, where Paul’s KC office was. Every time he and his assistant came on property I had this deep feeling of heavy sorrow, my 18 year old self could only rationalize it as a sense of sobriety, as I recognized a life of isolation, and this sense that his assistant was trapped in hiden-ness as well) as an adult, I have come to recognize it was an empathetic gift, and a discerning of the grief in God’s heart over Paul’s choices, and abuses. My heart has broken many times over when I think of what was taken from such a bright young man as his assistant was/is….
What we need most in the Body of Christ (besides Christ’s holy love) is HIS TREASURE which is “ The fear of the Lord.” Isaiah 33:6! We also need a deep abiding love for the Word of God. Many are deceived because the don’t fear God nor reverence HIS WORD. Check out Derek Prince ‘s teaching “The Fear of the Lord HIS TREASURE” (YOUTUBE).
Also John Bevere’s outstanding book THE AWE OF GOD! People who love the fear of the Lord will not even entertain a filthy thought! They know holiness is a weapon against the forces of darkness!
We also must stop putting people in leadership on pedestals! People in leadership need our prayers and accountability! No one who does not fear God nor reverence His Word should be in leadership over Christ’s Body…plain and simple!
This is fascinating. As a yound person at Vineyard Anaheim in the late 80's I witnessed some of what Jack is speaking about. I have a vivid memory of the first time I saw Paul Cain preach on the Anaheim stage. I was completely dumbfounded by the lack of Jesus or the Gospel in the message, and it was somewhat incoherent. I thought, "he must be having a bad day"......
Was there anyone out there to whom God revealed the secret of Paul Cain supernaturally? Yes, I was one of them. I was in an Episcopal Seminary Library outside of Pittsburgh, Pa. reading a Charisma Magazine article ( 1990) on the budding prophetic movement. Paul Cain's picture was featured. As I looked at him I heard the Holy Spirit say, "he struggles with homosexuality"! I was recently baptized in the Holy Spirit so hearing God clearly like this was surprising to me. I hide this for 14 years until the 2004 reveal of Paul's sins. Even If I had known how to share this with someone in leadership over Paul I would have been shut down. The prophets were almost worshipped at this time..
To be honest, I would challenge that anything from Paul was real. People are so desperate for something real they blind themselves to the con artist/grifter.
Paul learned from the best con/grifter - William Branham. Paul got that schtick down - just like Branham did - and all the phonies before that - Dowie,
For those interested in getting an education re Branham, healing revivals, Latter Rain, I recommend the work of John Collins (grandson of pastor at Branham's church in Jeffersonville) - William Branham Historical Research - - there are MANY very informative podcasts on YT - where the stage tricks and deception are exposed.
It was good to read such an honest assessment of Paul and I truly appreciate the honestly of Jack’s response to the false prophecy Paul gave to Jack.
Being in the ministry my husband are in since 1980 and having been in the Vineyard since 1979 we’ve trying to “help” broken leaders like Lonnie Frisbee to Paul Cain to many others. Unfortunately so often there isn’t the level of true confession and repentance that leads to their full personal restoration.
But can I say my favorite sentence was “John gave.”! I’m very aware that Wimber had shortcomings and made some mistakes along the way but knowing as well and as closely as we have is one of the greatest honors in my life.
In decades to come the impact of Wimber and the Vineyard will still be bearing fruit to the body of Christ. I’m glad we all get to play!